At the time of writing this review, October 23rd 2012, this Chinese based ZuluTrade Signal Provider has been trading on ZuluTrade for 75 weeks. At this time denganyouqianle are ranked 8th in the ZuluTrade rank and joined 2nd in terms of the amount of money invested in them. You’ll find the full denganyouqianle profile and historical performance here on the ZuluTrade website. Based on these here’s our review:
- consistent returns with only 1 losing month to date
- stops levels seem to be managed and monitored
- relatively low historical drawdown
- looks like this trader ‘trades’ the market and doesn’t use an automated system
- do not trade their own money
- no clear description of the strategy
- last 2 months limited communications
- only 3 star rating by followers
To date denganyouqianle has returned 5,472 pips for a maximum historical drawdown of 869 pips, which is a very reasonable return on the risk taken (please note we use the account level drawdown here from the profits chart as it’s higher than the open positions drawdown of 647). Another positive point when looking at this ZuluTrade SP’s returns is that the profits graph shows a fairly gradual increase in returns and to date only 1 out of 17 months was a losing month.
Identifying which strategy denganyouqianle uses is unfortunately very difficult since they don’t have a proper profile description and neither is it being communicated to their followers via the comments. What’s clear is that they only open 4 trades at the same time. Sometimes all 4 are in the same currency pair and direction, though not always. I.e. this is not a strategy which seems to open up additional positions against already losing ones.
With regards to the Forex pairs traded it’s mainly EURUSD, GBPUSD and AUDUSD. Looking at the historical ZuluTrade data it’s unclear what the entrance criteria are for the trades as it looks like a combination of methods are used (breakout, support, resistance, …). With regards to stop levels it looks like they’re managed depending on market conditions. I.e. they’re not fixed at the same level all the time and some trades are closed at small losses (e.g. 15 or 30 pips) while other trades are left to run with wider stops. The worst drawdown of a single trade to date was 241 pips.
This type of trading behaviour, together with the communications left by denganyouqianle in the past (just click older and use the translate button to read them) make us believe that this trader actually watches the market when they trade and don’t just blindly use an automated system. denganyouqianle also doesn’t seem to over-trade. I.e. this signal provider isn’t putting trades on every single day. Good traders know that some days are best left alone and it’s better to stay out of the market than to put on a trade just for the sake of it. Again without a proper profile or strategy description we can only make these deductions from the trading style and results we see (and hence they’re not substantiated).
denganyouqianle only has a 3 star rating which is slightly surprising seeing the returns have been fairly consistent and there hasn’t been any massively large drawdown. This signal provider also doesn’t seem to enter trades during news events or busy periods and hence the slippage we’ve noticed to date has been low.
Below is an example of account risk settings you may consider when following denganyouqianle with your ZuluTrade demo account. These are created use our ZuluTrade account settings tool (look on the tool page for further info):
Potential ZuluTrade account settings for denganyouqianle SP
Please note that a review of a signal provider isn’t an endorsement of this signal provider. Our ZuluTrade SP reviews are included here for educational purposes only and in no way do they constitute investment advice. To invest in denganyouqianle you need to open a ZuluTrade account. Please note that trading Forex is very risky and you should consult a financial advisor if you’re not sure whether these investment platforms are for you.
At the time of this review, October 22nd 2012, f8 has been trading on ZuluTrade for 138 weeks. At this time this Chinese based signal provider is ranked 3rd in the ZuluTrade ranking and has the 2nd largest amount of money invested in their system. Here’s our review based on the historical data (see f8 profile at ZuluTrade here):
- more than 2 years trading history
- many more profitable than losing months
- large amount of real ‘live’ followers
- high historical drawdown (which impacts risk/reward ratio)
- strategy description does not match actual strategy
- no regular communications
- only 3 star rating by followers
- large amount of other unsuccessful ZuluTrade accounts (most closed after losses)
- do not trade with their own money
With a history of over 2 years, f8 is one of the longest running signal providers in the top ranking of ZuluTrade. A return of over 32,000 pips with 26 winning months against 4 losing months is a very strong return over this period. They also have a large amount of live real money followers.
Their strategy opens up to 30 trades at the same time and the historical drawdown over this period is nearly 10,000 pips and hence very large. Some single positions have gone more than 1000 pips into the red and while this was in 2010, during 2012 the worst level a single position went into the red for f8 was still 440 pips. I.e. stop levels are not set closely and this is very much a long term system and signal provider.
The strategy description on f8’s ZuluTrade profile seems to suggest that “STOP LOSS at 50-150 pips” and “not more than 3 positions”. However, looking at the actual trading history, only last week over 7 AUDUSD SELL positions were opened at the same time with the worst one hitting -185 without being stopped out. Hence the actual strategy currently doesn’t reflect the one described. There’re also hardly any other communications from this signal provider which can shed more light on the actual strategy.
Trying to deduce the f8 strategy from the historical trades, they do seem to open up additional positions to add to losing positions. This means that if the market makes a small correction all positions can be closed out at break-even or a small profit. However, if the directional move persists for a long duration without making a correction, this can lead to very large drawdown, as has occurred in the past.
It’s also worth noting that this signal provider is listed at ZuluTrade under a large amount of different accounts as well, many of which have closed in losses (i.e. they have the bomb icon next to them).
There’s no arguing with the results of this signal provider on ZuluTrade to date have been positive, though when investing in f8 an investor will need to seriously consider the risk/reward ratio as well. I.e. what risk in terms of drawdown do you need to take in order to get the returns you’re expecting. The previous historical drawdown was 10,000 pips, though there’s never a guarantee that in the future the drawdown is not going to be higher, especially with 30 open trades and no clear/proven indication of the current stop levels.
Below is an indicative account setting calculation using our own ZuluTrade risk calculator tool. It does demonstrate that quite a large investment is needed in f8 to be able to cope with a potential drawdown of 10,000 pips or more.
Example of some f8 ZuluTrade SP risk calculations and account settings Oct 22 2012
Please note that this review and the calculations are included for informational purposes only. Historical results are not necessarily indicative of future results. Our review is not necessarily an endorsement of this ZuluTrade signal provider. Trading on ZuluTrade is risky and always consult an independent advisor is you’re not sure whether this investment vehicle is for you, and never invest money you cannot afford to lose.
Analyst EUR is a Polish based trader who has been trading on ZuluTrade since May 2012. They moved into the top 20 ranking in August and top 10 in September. At the time of writing this review, October 17th 2012, they’re ranked 13th. You can view the full ZuluTrade history for Analyst EUR here. Based on their (limited) trade data to date here’re our:
Analyst EUR Pros:
- results for the first 5 months were all positive with a low drawdown
Analyst EUR Cons:
- performance has been gradually decreasing
- stop levels are all set at the same level – no adjustments depending on market conditions
- profile strategy description doesn’t fully match actual strategy
- do not trade their own money
- profit taking strategy or levels are unclear (+10 to +180, though 70 pip profits turned into -60 losses)
- limited to no communication
- only 3 star rating to date
A profit of over 1400 in the first 5 months with a low drawdown propelled Analyst EUR into the ZuluTrade top 10 ranking. The maximum drawdown on open trades during that period was 116 pips (obviously low because they only open a maximum of 2 trades), though because this is a short term trader we also look at the drawdown from peak which has been about 280 pips. Looking a bit closer at the performance graphs per month you will however notice that most of the profits came in the first 3 months (especially the first one) and the last 3 months have actually been flat.
Analyst EUR Signal Provider historical performance on ZuluTrade until 17 Oct 12
The strategy description in the profile mentions stop levels being set at 30 or 60 pips, though looking at the historical trades, the last 3 months every losing trade was closed at about 60 pips. As we mention in our ZuluTrade SP selection tips section we’re not a fan of traders who use fixed stop levels. Professional traders will normally set their initial stop levels based on some support or resistance levels, and they’ll adjust their stops based on the current ‘live’ price action if needed. Setting levels at the same levels is very system/robot driven behaviour. This ZuluTrade signal provider also let profits of +70 pips turn into -60 losses which also doesn’t look great (most live traders would move their stops at least to break-even).
At time of writing they also have an EURUSD sell trade running, opened on October 5th for 1.3066, which is at time of writing was at -40 pips. However, this trade could have been closed at a profit of about 240 pips on October 11th. Hence the exit strategy is very unclear, even more so since Analyst EUR calls what they use an ‘intraday trend system’. Letting a 240 pip get away over 10 days is not an ‘intraday’ strategy.
While this ZuluTrade signal provider did provide some updates at the beginning, they’ve not communicated or provided updates for the past 45 days. The review comments from the followers also seem to echo their less than consistent performance over the past few months and lack of communication.
Obviously a trading history of just over 5 months is very limited to make a proper opinion of a trader. Time will tell whether Analyst EUR can prove that their first 3 months weren’t lucky and they can rediscover and repeat their early results.
Please not that this Analyst EUR Signal Provider review is included here for information purposes only and does not in any way constitute advice. Investing in ZuluTrade and other Forex social trading networks is very risky and you should consult an independent financial advisor if you’re not sure. Never invest money you cannot afford to lose.
Hertcz is at the time of this review still a very new signal provider on ZuluTrade with only 17 weeks history. They send their trades from Indonesia and on October 11th 2012 were ranked 26 in the ZuluTrade rankings. Based on the (limited) historical performance (click here to view Hertcz profile on ZuluTrade) here’s our review:
- impressive results for the first 16 weeks
- strategy is stated (breakout strategy)
- stop loss levels seem to be managed and losses are booked
- follows with their demo account signal from a live account
- 4 star average rating by 40 live users
- very limited historical data
- unclear how many open trades are required to follow this signal provider
- communication not always consistent and clear
With a pip gain of over 2000 pips for a maximum drawdown of 400 pips, the results of Hertcz to date are pretty impressive. The strategy of this ZuluTrade signal provider (breakout) is clearly stated and looking at the trade history this seems to be indeed the strategy they use and follow on a number of currency pairs. Stop loss levels seem be managed and set at swing high/lows. Losses are therefore taken and trades are not left open for long period of time. Worst single trade so far was -156 loss. We personally see this as a good thing since while this may incur a few losing trades in a row in the account, it means some kind of protection for when the markets rally in 1 direction for a long period of time.
While this trader does communicate via the ZuluTrade interface, the communications are not always clear. E.g. historically there’ve been a maximum of 8 open trades and on September 5th there were still 4 open trades. Hertcz communications 64 days ago seemed to suggest allowing 2 open position, which from mid September became 3. I.e. there seems to be difference between what’s communicated and what’s traded. That is definitely a worry. You may also want to ignore their first video as it doesn’t tell us anything about their strategy or trading style.
Hertcz is definitely one to watch based on their initial performance, though 4 months is a very limited time period to make a fair opinion about a trader or trading system. It’ll also be interesting to see how this trader behaves and copes when more ZuluTrade people start following them, and more importantly how they cope/recover from a series of losing trades (which will be inevitable) and the negative feedback comments which may follow as result.
Below are the historical numbers for Hertcz thrown into our ZuluTrade account settings tool (for the risk definitions click here). We used the data for 17 weeks as 4 months. Historical performance is obviously no guarantee for future performance and because the limited historical data, the value of these calculations is a bit limited. Also because Hertcz traded on some pairs where the USD is not the quote currency.
Hertcz potential account settings calculations
Please note that this ZuluTrade signal provider review of Hertcz is included for informational purposes only. These reviews do not constitute advice. Social Trading is very risky and never invest without consulting a financial advisor and never invest money you cannot afford to lose.
For333 is a Chinese Signal Provider who became ZuluTrade’s nr1 ranked trader on September 14th. They have been trading this system on ZuluTrade for the past 55 weeks. Looking at for333’s historical performance information on ZuluTrade, here’re our:
- 10 consecutive profitable months (and that’s including any unrealised PnL)
- 4 star customer feedback rating (average from 175 live followers)
- large balance of live money following > $5million
- > 1 year history
- do not trade their own money
- strategy not explained clearly in profile
- no communication with followers
- 2 historical trades hit the 500 pip loss level (which is the default Stop Level). Arguably these were at the beginning in September 2011 and since then the maximum drawdown on a single open position was 295 pips
- part of the strategy seems to involve adding additional positions to losing positions in the hope/assumption the market will reverse enough to close all at break-even (e.g. 6 open buy positions in EURUSD on August 10th 2012, same on June 27th 2012)
- historical drawdown over the full period is fairly high, > 1000 pips (with 9 open trades). Over the past 6 month it has been 825 pips with maximum of 6 open trades
for333 historical performance on ZuluTrade
The results over the past 10 months are very impressive for for333 and the 4 star feedback rating from a significant amount of ZuluTrade customers means people have actually been making money following this signal provider. In our view, some caution has to be given though because this trader does not trade their own money and the strategy is in no way explained. It’s unclear how many open trades for333 requires their followers to allow (9 is the maximum over 1 year and 6 over the past 6 months). There’s also no clear indication what stop levels are used (if any) and the fact 2 previous positions went to 500 pip negative is a worry as well. The fact that multiple trades are opened in the same direction, adding to losing positions, can also lead to significant drawdown or losses when the market moves in 1 direction without a significant retrace.
Below are some potential lot sizes calculated using our ZuluTrade account settings tool using for333’s historical data from the past 6 months (we prefer to use a longer period, though the strategy looked more stable over the past 6 months). Please also note that the calculations are slightly impacted by the fact some trades include exotic pairs (EURAUS and GBPJPY), though because there were only a few of those the impact is small.
Calculation of potential lot sizes for investing in for333 with a ZuluTrade demo account
Please note that this review is included here for information purposes only and the lot size calculations for following for333 with a ZuluTrade demo account. Historical results are not necessarily indicative of future performance. Please contact a financial advisor if you consider investing in ZuluTrade with real money.
Going forward we’re going to update you with the main movers in the ZuluTrade Signal Provider ranking top 10 each month. I.e. which are the newcomers and which signal providers have disappeared (and why).
Below is a chart of the top 10 Zulu rank on October 2nd 2012, compared with the positions on September 1st 2012.
Please note that we’ll be posting a full review of the key new entries in the coming weeks.
for333: This Chinese based Signal Provider with 4 star reviews and over 1 year experience on ZuluTrade moves to nr 1 rank from 12 previous month.
for000: From 14 to 4, this looks very much like a different strategy from the same Signal Provider who’s in top position (well, their logo seems to suggest so at least)
QueVadisFX: This Greece SP makes another appearance in the top 10 (from 52) where they last appeared in March 2012
Analyst EUR: Analyst EUR makes its first appearance in the top 10.
Droid: Massive move up from 163 this ZuluTrade SP makes another appearance in top top 10. Their historical drawdown looks frightenly high and the fact that their very eratic ranking is not a great sign either.
SINIGAMI: Another Signal Provider with a massive historical drawdown moves into the top 10 from 25.
We unfortunately lost the ZuluTrade rank table from September 1st, so cannot report on all the ones which dropped out of the top 10. However, the nr1 at that date, Pohingsystemmodel, has dropped to position 212. Looking at their results, this SP had a horrible month of September, raking in losses of over 2000 pips (1640 of which was already realised). It’s also noticeable that most of the closed trades were stopped out at the 500 pip level, which seems to be the arbitrary level most longer term or system traders put on their trades.
So, how could you have avoided this loss? Well, anyone who read our ZuluTrade tips will know to be wary about Signal Providers who:
– use a strategy which ads to losing positions in the “hope” the market will eventually turn (obviously it didn’t in this case!)
– don’t manage their stop (or close trades) based on the current market situation, but use the default 500 pip stop level
– have large historical drawdowns
However, if you’d invested in Pohingsystemmodel since January 1st 2012 you’d still be in positive territory (unless of course you increased your lot sizes during that period). In case you’d want to follow this type of trader, they key for not getting margin calls here would have been very conservative lot size settings. The account drawdown in September was a bit more than double than two previous drawdowns, which as mentioned in the ZuluTrade risk & money management tips section is the least you should be able to expect.
ZuluTrade Top 10 Signal Provider Rank October 2nd 2012
It is now possible to open a AAAfx trading account with GBP, JPY, AUD and CHF base currency. AAAfx is ZuluTrade’s (the popular social trading network) preferred broker (they’re both part of the same company). This move is good news for any investors from countries with those base currencies who like to trade on ZuluTrade using AAAfx. Before it was only possible to open accounts in EUR or USD, which meant investors would take on an extra currency exchange risk if they funded their accounts in a currency other than USD or EUR.
The key ‘advertised’ advantages of using a AAAfx account when trading on ZuluTrade is their direct integration, 0 commission and full refund policy. The 0 (zero) commission does make them attractive, though because of the difference in spreads your costs per trade may be similar to other brokers who charge 0.5 or 1 pip commission. The full refund policy is a key factor as it means that if for any reason a trade from a ZuluTrade trader (“signal provider”) you copy isn’t closed properly (or timely) in your account they’ll give you a full refund of any losses you may have incurred because of this.
You can click here to open a AAAfx account. Please note that this opens a ZuluTrade account for you as well as this is now standard. Accounts can there now be opened in EUR, USD, JPY, CHF, AUD and GBP base currency.
AAAFx was founded in 2008 and manages thousands of live accounts from over 175 countries globally. Its headquarters are in Athens, Greece.
Click Here to visit AAAfx
Currensee has changed the way in which you can set the leverage and hence risk of your account. As an investor in the Currensee Trade Leader program you used to be able to reduce the risk on your account by reducing the leverage per Trade Leader you follow in your account. I.e. setting the Leverage Multiplier to 50% would mean that if the Trade Leader traded at a leverage of 10:1 in their account, a leverage of 5:1 would be used in your account.
Now however, you can also increase the leverage and take more risk in your account by setting the Currensee Leverage Multiplier to a value higher than 100%. E.g. setting the multiplier to 200% for a Trade Leader would mean that when they trade at 5:1 leverage, your leverage would be 10:1. Increasing the leverage increases the size of the trade you copy from the Trade Leader, giving you the potential opportunity to take more advantage of their profitable trades. However please be aware that increasing the leverage will also increase the size of any potential losses in your account.
Also bear in mind that when you increase the leverage you should consider increasing the Maximum Drawdown setting for that Trade Leader to insure the Drawdown Protection isn’t triggered unnecessarily in your account. E.g. if the setting was set to 30% (taking into account the Trade Leader’s past maximum drawdown) and you increase leverage to 200% you should consider increasing your Maximum Drawdown to 60%. The increase should be comparable to the additional risk you intend to take.
The additional functionality of leveraging up now means Currensee gives you total control in how much or little risk you take in your portfolio. Please be aware though that increasing the risk may mean significant loss of your investment when the Trade Leader you copy makes losing trades.